Skip to main content
This forum is closed to new posts and responses. Individual names altered for privacy purposes. The information contained in this website is provided for informational purposes only and should not be construed as a forum for customer support requests. Any customer support requests should be directed to the official HCL customer support channels below:

HCL Software Customer Support Portal for U.S. Federal Government clients
HCL Software Customer Support Portal

HCL Notes/Domino 8.5 Forum (includes Notes Traveler)

HCL Notes/Domino 8.5 Forum (includes Notes Traveler)

Previous Next

YES WE CAN :))

[NSF versus a relational DB
Add these requirements to the "employee" example you gave:
- granular field-level security to access certian employee-specific data
- replication (especially offline)
- each employee has a variable number of user-defined fields for tracking metadata]

you are talking about things that already exist for a while. there is nothing new (and exceptional) in the application dev area for years (Except DB2NSF).

[...and all of a sudden NSF is much more attractive. Read my blog entries -- there is a lot that you can build into Notes (though, yes, it would be nice if it was supported natively) that makes it behave more like a true relational database.]
if the server core doesn's support the functionality you canot really simulate it. DB2 is relational and supports transactions, so you have the infrastructure to start something.

[In my experience it's much harder to make a relational database as flexible as NSF. IBM learned this the hard way. After years of trying to migrate NSF to DB2 (NSF<>DB2 was a step towards that final destination) IBM decided to quit doing it.]
replication between databases exists for a while.
security is also implemented thru some frameworks like Acegi.
since db2 viper there are also new enhancements for manupulating unstructured data like XML (or DXL should I say !)
For sure, it is not as easy as domino but in regards of what i observe from IBM, making NSF relational seems impossible.


[Keep in mind that IBM has said they are no longer moving forward on enhancing NSF/DB2, but they simultaneously said that they ARE moving forward on enhancing NSF. And they know that people want relational-type capabilities.]
IBM says something today another thing tomorrow. I simply have the impression that they don't know what to do and worst, where to go. (once again in the dev app area)
All the innovative strategy is focused on messaging and nothing happens in the dev part. (ok there are 3 new @functions !!).

They spend time developing something (garnet, workplace, db2nsf...) and then they throw it away. this is a major technical/strategical problem which happens every 2 or 3 years with them (I don't imagine the reaction of people deeply involved in these projects, they must be disgusted)
It seems that the captain changes every hour and cancels previous orders for giving new ones. the ship is zigzaging and the passengers are sick !

what I'm saying is quite easy - they should decide what they want and stop playing with the community like that
A) transform Domino to a full SOA messaging (or even /repository) platform. (it's the actual path)
or
B) transform Domino to a real application server platform (which means AT LEAST, relational capabilities), but it seems too difficult for them, or maybe they really don't want to compete with internal softs (websphere / portal / db2 / tivoli ).

if this is not done, Domino is doomed to decline little by little .... what is actually happening (at least in the Application server area)

ps : come on, we are in 2009... IBM should say : YES WE CAN :))


Feedback response number WEBB7NWJAJ created by ~Judy Destookonyetsi on 02/03/2009

DB2NSF replacement (~Judy Destookon... 29.Jan.09)
. . Does this mean that DB2 integration... (~Elizabeth Cish... 29.Jan.09)
. . . . . . xpages can incorporate DB2 access (Roland Reddekop... 2.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . Toy or Trojan? (Roland Reddekop... 2.Feb.09)
. . NSFDB2 plans (~Tate Nonkizenl... 29.Jan.09)
. . . . I would suggest that you didn't tal... (~Dana Chulumarf... 29.Jan.09)
. . . . I need View Contention to go away (~Chris Bubfreep... 29.Jan.09)
. . . . . . Writing out to RDBMS (~Dana Chulumarf... 29.Jan.09)
. . . . how would you handle huge #docs and... (~Tanita Asaboos... 29.Jan.09)
. . . . Domino is a repository (~Olga Asaponeso... 2.Feb.09)
. . . . . . Domino/Notes is really business wor... (~Isaac Quetnute... 20.Feb.09)
. . . . . . use the rigth design (Ioan Crisan 20.Feb.09)
. . . . the second Garnet move (~Judy Destookon... 29.Jan.09)
. . . . . . NSFDB2 support available until 2017... (~Tate Nonkizenl... 29.Jan.09)
. . . . . . . . Query views...but requesting which ... (~Nicole Minaber... 30.Jan.09)
. . . . . . . . . . use the agent trigger "when docs ar... (Ioan Crisan 20.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . actually this one is (Ioan Crisan 24.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . transactions (Pejman Parandi 2.Feb.09)
. . There's more discussion on NSF's po... (~Sanjay Quettum... 29.Jan.09)
. . . . the backend is poor (~Judy Destookon... 2.Feb.09)
. . . . . . Rating something as "Poor" is relat... (~Gus Chukikonyo... 2.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . The idea has long history... (Vladimir Panov 3.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . That's very interesting... (~Sanjay Quettum... 3.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . NSF versus a relational DB (~Sanjay Quettum... 2.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . YES WE CAN :)) (~Judy Destookon... 3.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . simple applications need relational... (~Judy Destookon... 3.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . LMAO (~Naomi Deskrote... 4.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . obscured by clouds (~Judy Destookon... 5.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . "Happy with what I already have" (~Naomi Deskrote... 7.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . LMAO at "chasing with a pitchfork" (~Sanjay Quettum... 8.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . dynamic queries, triggers ... (~Judy Destookon... 10.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Normalization (~Naomi Deskrote... 10.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . pet store application (~Judy Destookon... 10.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Defining your own limitations (~Naomi Deskrote... 12.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . eCommerce web sites (~Judy Destookon... 13.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . I don't think you're clear on the m... (~Naomi Deskrote... 13.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . fact = market <eom> (~Judy Destookon... 13.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . by the way (~Judy Destookon... 10.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . Trivial (~Naomi Deskrote... 4.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . db2nsf (~Judy Destookon... 5.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . Agreed (~Sanjay Quettum... 5.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . Resolving keys in a view (~Olga Asaponeso... 5.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . Yesterday's complaint (~Naomi Deskrote... 7.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . NSFDB2 helped Lotusscript programme... (Nathan T. Freem... 10.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . pureXML (Pejman Parandi 10.Feb.09)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . The query views work in all version... (Bruce Lill 24.Feb.09)




Printer-friendly

Search this forum

Member Tools


RSS Feeds

 RSS feedsRSS
All forum posts RSS
All main topics RSS